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Thread: A question of "beats"

  1. #1
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    Default A question of "beats"

    Hi All: This tis what will probably be the first of several posts/questions. I will probably be buying a Procyon the near future (am currently using a friends Proteus) and a couple of questions come to mind as a result of my quite positive experiences.

    Me- a 69 year old semi retired psychologist with some basic exposure to biofeedback some decades ago and long term interests in neuropsychology and hypnosis, among other stuff. Also at the tender age of 6 years I fell on my head and have been deaf in left ear since, with probably a bit of contra coup in the right parietal area.

    Having looked through the forums the question remains if anyone has information regarding the ?usefulness? of monaural/isochronic vs. binaural vs. dual binaural beats for one who finds hi fi good enough because he can?t receive stero; or, perhaps if the audio will only serve to keep an easily entertained person, entertained?

    Anyone have any information/opinion?
    Gust in invigorating Wisconsin who/whom has never met a person he couldn't learn from.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: A question of "beats" Also submitted to Proteus Forum

    Generally speaking, monaural and isochronic both have a higher probability of leading to entrainment than binaural.

    My inclination, however, would be to listen to "something nice" while using the glasses to provide AVS/entrainment. I suspect that regularly stimulating one hemisphere while the other remains in silence may be problematic.

    Light is typically more compelling than sound anyway.

    Cheers,
    Craig

  3. #3

    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    Gust,

    In general, light is the most entraining medium. So as long as you have at least one eye, you should be able to be entrained.

    I find mono/isochronic more entraining than binaurial beats. So with one good ear, you should be ok as long as you avoid binaural beats.

    The best Light and Sound machine for you, in my opinion, is the Mindplace Sirius. This unit will do everthing you need to do and it's built-in sessions are all done in monaural beats, unlike the Proteus and Procyon which use binaurials in most of their sessions.

    The best news is that the Sirius is only ~$100. The Sirius works fine with advanced session programimng tools like Transparent Corp's NP2 software. Combine this with your Sirius, and the sky's the limit.

    Good luck, and have fun,
    TomC

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    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    Quote Originally Posted by TomC View Post
    Gust,

    The best Light and Sound machine for you, in my opinion, is the Mindplace Sirius. This unit will do everthing you need to do and it's built-in sessions are all done in monaural beats, unlike the Proteus and Procyon which use binaurials in most of their sessions.
    TomC[/quote]

    IMHO I find the Sirius limiting because it's not programmable. I have found it very useful to be able to create my own programs and be able to modify or work from the pre-existing ones. For an extra $60, the Proteus - I think would be a better buy - if one's budget is tight. Also, the other thing I find valuable about the programmable machines is the ability to update the OS. As you have seen, there have been quite a few upgrades to both the Proteus and Procyon OS over the past few years.

    I do agree with you though that the Sirius will do the same job as the rest of the machines (or any AVS machine) in the end - just without the extras - which does suite some people just fine.

    Thanks for your input Tom! Your opinions and comments are always highly valued here.

    M.
    Marisa Broughton, MCHT, MNLP
    Canadian Distributor for Mindplace
    http://www.ayrmetes.com

    Hey, if someone makes a good post, don't forget to click http://www.mindplacesupport.com/foru...ations-40b.png at the bottom of their post to add to their reputation!

  5. #5
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    Smile Re: A question of "beats" Also submitted to Proteus Forum

    Thanks Craig. As a matter of curiosity since the left ear auditory cortex has been "silent" for 63 years what do you feel may be "problematic" with AVS/entrainment?

    I did get from the forums that visual is the stronger of the 2 sensory modes - so perhapsthere tis hope for me yet.



    Quote Originally Posted by CraigT View Post
    "something nice" while using the glasses to provide AVS/entrainment. I suspect that regularly stimulating one hemisphere while the other remains in silence may be problematic.

    Light is typically more compelling than sound anyway.

    Cheers,
    Craig
    Gust in invigorating Wisconsin who/whom has never met a person he couldn't learn from.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    Hi Gust,

    Welcome to the forum!

    Quote Originally Posted by gust View Post
    Hi All: This tis what will probably be the first of several posts/questions. I will probably be buying a Procyon the near future (am currently using a friends Proteus) and a couple of questions come to mind as a result of my quite positive experiences.
    The Procyon is the most versatile of our machines because you essentially have six light frames built in (you can turn off the other two colors if you wish or choose any combination of them). Not to mention the ganzfeld capability and 255 shades (vs 15 in the Proteus). In addition, you can go up to 75 Hz (as opposed to 50 Hz in the Proteus) and it's got a USB as opposed to Serial.

    Having said all that, I still like the Proteus. It is one solid machine. As I mentioned in my reply to Tom, I'm not the biggest fan of the Sirius (only because I find it limiting for what I want out of a machine - and that is to be able to modify or create my own programs).

    Me- a 69 year old semi retired psychologist with some basic exposure to biofeedback some decades ago and long term interests in neuropsychology and hypnosis, among other stuff.
    That is awesome. It is so wonderful to have someone with your experience and knowledge on our forum. I'm fascinated by so many different areas of psychology (neuro, behavioral) and am quite excited to have another person on this forum to share thoughts, knowledge and information with.

    Also at the tender age of 6 years I fell on my head and have been deaf in left ear since, with probably a bit of contra coup in the right parietal area.
    That must have been quite a fall! Did it affect your balance? How much do you notice the lack of hearing in the one ear?

    Having looked through the forums the question remains if anyone has information regarding the ?usefulness? of monaural/isochronic vs. binaural vs. dual binaural beats for one who finds hi fi good enough because he can?t receive stereo; or, perhaps if the audio will only serve to keep an easily entertained person, entertained?
    The supremacy of binaural vs monaural beats has been quite controversial. I've seen studies and read/heard testimonials that support each claim and have concluded that it comes down to which studies you choose to believe and perhaps most important, your own personal experience.

    M.
    Marisa Broughton, MCHT, MNLP
    Canadian Distributor for Mindplace
    http://www.ayrmetes.com

    Hey, if someone makes a good post, don't forget to click http://www.mindplacesupport.com/foru...ations-40b.png at the bottom of their post to add to their reputation!

  7. #7
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    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    Thanks for the quick information Tom/Marisa! Your responses have engendered further questions. Didn't your mother teach you to not talk to strangers?


    1) Tom you comment, as Craig did on the other forum,
    "you should be ok as long as you avoid binaural beats." Question, is there a reason for one with a broken ear to avoid them, other than the fact that they won't work?

    2) Ahh, Tom, ye give me too much credit when you speak of "advanced session programing tools". I had trouble with 2 tin cans and a string during childhood.
    Which is the EASIEST to program?

    3) Marisa, what if any are the differences between the Proteus and Procyon in terms of programming ease, light quality, etc? As I recall w/o doing a search right now, the Procyon has greater color range, extends Hz up to 75, uses surface mounted LEDs
    and more LED colors?

    4) Marisa, you made a response about about "beats" in another thread as follows,"if you play, say 400 HS and 410 Hz in the same ear; you can hear the beat frequency in one ear." I be confused!!!! Is this useful for entrainment? If so do your machines do it?

    Your answers are greatly appreciated, but be warned they will likely engender more questions.

    One eared curmudgeon
    Gust in invigorating Wisconsin who/whom has never met a person he couldn't learn from.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: A question of "beats" Also submitted to Proteus Forum

    The intent with entrainment is to induce parts of the brain other than the sensory cortices to sync with the stimulus - asymmetrical sessions are often used to train the respective hemispheres in different ranges. Stimulating one hemisphere and completely not the other bothers me. Lights get you around the problem quite nicely.
    Cheers,
    Craig

  9. #9
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    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    As you are going to be relying on the lights for most of the effect, you might as well get the most visually interesting machine on the market - the Procyon rocks and I don't care what anyone else thinks!!!!!

    I have almost every AVS gizmo known to man or beast, and the Procyon remains my personal machine, alongside my bed, rarely turned off.

    Cheers,
    Craig

  10. #10
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    Default Re: A question of "beats"

    Thanks for the nice welcome Marisa and the good information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marisa View Post

    That must have been quite a fall! Did it affect your balance? How much do you notice the lack of hearing in the one ear?

    M.
    Hot Kentucky sun, hot steel sliding board, school playground, 1st grader with short pants, tries to hang legs over the sides at the top, fails miserably but succeeds in finding the ground.

    Scared of heights as youngster and still over anxious as adult - for years gave usual psychological interpretation of psychologically traumatic event, but as got into brains (would keep an occasional one in the refrigerator, between the cheese and salami) realized that in addition of having lost half of hearing, also lost half of balance. Interesting though past 10 years or so though yogi balancing has muchly improved - guess old dogs can learn new neural loops. Woof!

    No stero so no sound directionality - when taught, asked class to make movement when asking a question, otherwise I be frantically scanning faces to see whose lips were moving. Walking in woods when hear bear snort, have no idea which way to run,etc.

    Back to business -----

    Read somewhere that blue tends to promote alpha, an area of interest. If so does/can the Procyon produce more blue than the Proteus? 'Nother area of interest tis Tibetan monks and gamma, despite not having a Faraday cage - Bummer.

    Decisions, decisions, decisions - I hate to think
    Gust in invigorating Wisconsin who/whom has never met a person he couldn't learn from.

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