Which machine

[Rocky]

Hi All

I'm new here - and haven't used one of these mind machines before - but looking to purchase my first this week. The main reasons I want it are:

* Help me to sleep - and sleep all night
* Energise me in the morning
* Help with a drink problem (if possible).
* General personal development

Could someone recommend the best machine for me - and what type of programs I might like to run.

Many thanks


Rocky

[synaesthesia]

Hi Rocky , I 'm sure all the Mindplace machines can help you with those things, they certainly have for me. I own the Proteus and the newer Procyon. I can recommend the Proteus if you are after good `bang for buck' . It has all the basics required for an AVS machine, as well as Audiostrobe decoding , 2 colour glasses, and a fully manual mode which the Procyon doesn't have.

[Rocky]

Thats for that Synaesthesia!

I was surprised you went for a slightly older model. Cost is not a problem (within reason of course). Most models are about $225 here - and I waste $450 a month on booze and rubbish that goes with drinking.

I use to have a stressfull job and would drink before bed to stop my brain talking and get a good nights sleep. Job gone but now need the drink to get to sleep. I keep waking up / have a few muscle/joint pains that help keep me awake.

How good are these machines by themselves for ending a drink or other addiction. What program would be go for.

Would people tend to fall asleep with them on / or just move to a very sleepy state before a nights sleep. Any comments on pzziz (which is just a sound machine not light & sound). Cheers :-)

[Marisa]

Hi Rocky,

Hi All

I'm new here - and haven't used one of these mind machines before - but looking to purchase my first this week. The main reasons I want it are:

* Help me to sleep - and sleep all night
* Energise me in the morning
* Help with a drink problem (if possible).
* General personal development

Could someone recommend the best machine for me - and what type of programs I might like to run.

Many thanks


Rocky

I would go with either the Proteus or the Procyon. Both machines are programmable which is a useful feature even if you do not plan on writing your own programs. Being programmable allows you to update the OS as well as download programs other people have written.

Studies have shown that people with addiction problems tend to be deficient in Alpha waves. An alpha program will help with the cravings. Essentially what you want to be able to do is increase your serotonin levels which will also help quiet the cravings. You may find yourself needed the machine more at first and less with time. It's part of the reconditioning process as you have to teach your brain some new tricks.

What has happened in the brain with addiction is that the part of the brain that is in charge of survival has gotten some bad programming and now associates drinking (or drugging) with survival. This is why you would feel that you "have to" have a drink or else. It takes some time, but this condition can be reversed and your brain can be retrained and overwrite the bad programming.

Both the Proteus and Procyon have programs that can help "wake" you up and help you sleep as well. Some of what is going on with you is because your biochemistry is out of whack. If you have been drinking, you probably are also deficient in some vitamins.

There are two really good books (and one website) that I can recommend. The first book is called, "The Craving Brain" by Ronald A Ruden, M.D.; Ph.D. and the second is called "Rational Recovery" by Jack Trimpey - web site: http://www.rational.org/ . I don't believe in the 12 step model for a few reasons so I won't recommend A.A. There are other ways, better ways. IMHO.

If you do buy a machine, let me know which one you buy and I'll tell you what programs will be most useful. Who knows, I may even modify one just for you.

M.

[Rocky]

Thats a very kind offer Marisa! I've just joined this group of yours - but can see how much you have put in and helped people so much.

My procyon arrived today :-) I've also ordered the 2 books via amazon which should be here soon hopefully.

So which programs would you suggest for
* Getting sleeply - ready for sleep (don't want to fall asleep with them on) - stopping the mind chattering so much / feeling or notice minor joint pains etc
* Waking the mind up in a morning - in a positive motivated fashion if poss
* Reduce alcohol cravings

Many thanks Marisa! :-) Will give it a test run tonight :-)


Rocky

[Marisa]

Thats a very kind offer Marisa! I've just joined this group of yours - but can see how much you have put in and helped people so much.

Thank you for the kind words - It's people like you who inspire me to be as helpful as possible.

My procyon arrived today :-) I've also ordered the 2 books via amazon which should be here soon hopefully.

Excellent! I'll be interested to know what you think of them and if you find them helpful.

So which programs would you suggest for
* Getting sleeply - ready for sleep (don't want to fall asleep with them on) - stopping the mind chattering so much / feeling or notice minor joint pains etc
- reduce alcohol cravings

For getting ready for sleep, you can choose a shorter length of the Night Voyage Program (15 to 25 minutes) Programs: 23 or 24

Stopping the mind chatter, may as well reduce alcohol cravings at the same time - choose Alpha programs: P 5, 16, 18-20, 36, 39, 40-45. There is quite a few to choose from. Some may work better for you than others.

* Waking the mind up in a morning - in a positive motivated fashion if poss

P9, 15, 28. These are basically short Alpha/SMR programs.

I've attached a chart that you can use for a reference. Stick to Alpha based programs. SMR is also good for concentration, so Alpha/SMR programs are also okay. Alpha/Theta programs - you'll probably find them relaxing.

Many thanks Marisa! :-) Will give it a test run tonight :-)

Let me know how it goes.

P.S. It will probably be helpful for you to become aware of your self-talk (what you say to yourself and how you say it). Recognize what the "addictive voice" sounds like and the arguments it tries to use to get you to drink. The goal is to recognize the addictive voice and laugh at it's ridiculous arguments. This may take a bit of doing but it is possible.

Once you become more aware of your self talk, you will be able to move to the next stage and start working to change that talk. It's important to change or at least be in control over your self talk because your brain (unconscious) programs how you perceive life according to what your self talk is. In addition, if you give yourself too many negative messages, you create stress and deplete the serotonin, which then leads to a craving to drink.

So - think about what you want instead of what you don't want.

Avoid telling yourself things like "I can't drink" and tell yourself things like, "I can drink if I want to and I choose to do something else." It's a little mental programming trick. Since the mind always goes towards what you are thinking about, if all you think about is - how you shouldn't drink - it will create more cravings to drink ... so the idea is to think about something else, anything else. Get involved in a hobby or some activities that keep you busy (paint, renovate, exercise anything). If you get an urge to drink, just tell youself - "later" and get busy doing something ... later can mean in 200 years. That way you don't feel like you are denying yourself something, you are just putting it off. It's an easier way to avoid doing something. You can get really good at procrastinating about having a drink.

M.

M.