What do people really do during their sessions?

What do people do during their sessions?

My default is to sit in a comfortable chair turn on a session and be completely passive. Usually this ends in sleep, or I blank out and come to when the session ends.

I thought blanking out was a sign of progress and that electronic nirvana was within reach. Sadly, a year down the road sleep and blank outs are the plateau points I have reached.

I have also used a variety of sessions with breathing focused meditation (counting breaths to 10 then starting over). This approach leads to less sleep and no blank out. I do not note any major differences between the meditation experience with and without AV entrainment.

I have had the luck to see EEG feedback while using a Proteus; there is no question that major brain electrical patterns marched in line to the machine. Why was that profound change in brain activity not accompanied by a profound feeling, emotion or consciousness change?

I enjoy my sessions, but I feel that I am missing something. It is tantalizing to know that these devices make same parts of our brain purr like a kitten, but leave other parts less than amused.

I am curious, what do other people do to get the most out of their sessions? What specific procedures (thoughts, settings, music, activities) have made your sessions go beyond relaxation?

Don't get me wrong, relaxation is a good thing, but I don't think it is all that these devices can do.

Thanks for your input.

:eusa_think:

Hi ek49,

Interesting experiences you have had. I too will often fall asleep if I am too comfortable, like lying on a comfy bed. Sounds like your comfortable chair may not be helping you too much if sleep if not what you want :)

As you have meditation experience without the machine, I would suggest you try sitting spine erect on the floor (or simple chair) in 'typical' meditation pose and then use your Proteus to see if you can deepen your experience.

You do not mention use of music, so maybe try running some relaxing Mike Oldfield or similar instrumental music while in your session. Learn some programming and sync the music to your Proteus. And you could also try some AudioStrobe music - did you get a sampler CD? If not, you can grab some MP3 samples on line to try, but make sure bit rate is 192 or better to be sure the AudioStrobe sampling works. You can grab some 5 minute AS samples here.

And you may just be trying too hard!? I met monthly with a group of Buddhist meditators many years ago and upset some of the 'seniors' with my descriptions of meditation experience. They were upset due to having meditated for 30 years and experienced nothing more than deep relaxation states. Having a young kid describe unusual 'weird' experiences did not make any friends. If you are trying too hard, just let go. Easier said than done, I know. :icon_twisted:

Hope that helps. Will get back to you again when got a little more time!

Hi EK49

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Originally Posted by ek49

What do people do during their sessions?

My default is to sit in a comfortable chair turn on a session and be completely passive. Usually this ends in sleep, or I blank out and come to when the session ends.

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If it's a "regeneration" or "mindsauna" session, I will usually fall asleep half way through but feel great when I wake up. I would use one of these sessions to recharge my batteries so falling asleep is actually a good thing.

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I thought blanking out was a sign of progress and that electronic nirvana was within reach. Sadly, a year down the road sleep and blank outs are the plateau points I have reached.

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Feelings of euphoria usually result from increased serotonin levels, which coincide with Alpha brainwaves. If you are going too deep - you are generating more theta or delta brainwaves than alpha. You may want to try a program such as P9, 33 or 34. These are Alpha based programs.

You can also try some of the Alpha/Beta or Alpha/Theta combinations. Ideally you want to choose a program that stays in the 8-11hz range.

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I have also used a variety of sessions with breathing focused meditation (counting breaths to 10 then starting over). This approach leads to less sleep and no blank out. I do not note any major differences between the meditation experience with and without AV entrainment.

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That's good information.

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I have had the luck to see EEG feedback while using a Proteus; there is no question that major brain electrical patterns marched in line to the machine. Why was that profound change in brain activity not accompanied by a profound feeling, emotion or consciousness change?

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In order to experience a profound change in state, an orchestra composed of biochemicals, brain parts and thought process need to play a certain song together. Brain waves are only one component or player in that orchestra. Sometimes the piece played is particularly moving (for example, we see something that inspires an emotional reaction) which in turn causes a chain reaction of biochemicals to flood the brain in response.

An AVS machine is a conductor in the orchestra. The conductor influences the instrument (in this case, your brain waves) to change their song to another and the rest of the instruments (other parts of your brain) soon follow in harmony. It's more of a subtle change that occurs because the brain likes to be in balance. The feeling of Nirvana is one of peace and being okay in the universe. It's more of a balanced feeling than something like euphoria which is closer to a feeling of excitement.

So in sum, in order for a profound change in brain state, you will need to actively invoke something emotionally stimulating (such as a thought, a visualization or particular sound). The machine can put you in the right state of mind and then what you do with it ...makes the change.

Does this make sense? BTW, that was an excellent question!

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I am curious, what do other people do to get the most out of their sessions? What specific procedures (thoughts, settings, music, activities) have made your sessions go beyond relaxation?

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What gives me that ahhhhh feeling is to put the Proteus on P48 or 49 and then plug my headphones into the stereo (computer, MP3 player etc) and listen to something like Pink Floyd or Steve Vai and watch the lights from the Proteus. I do not plug the headphones into the Proteus, as at that time, I'm in for the visual effects and the music invokes the emotional result.

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Don't get me wrong, relaxation is a good thing, but I don't think it is all that these devices can do.

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You are absolutely right, there are many things one can do with the machines ... which is why I'm such an enthusiast.

M.:headbang:

Thank you both for your thoughtful replies.

I will need some time to put my response into words and to figure out how to plug them effectively into this web format.

More later!

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So in sum, in order for a profound change in brain state, you will need to actively invoke something emotionally stimulating (such as a thought, a visualization or particular sound). The machine can put you in the right state of mind and then what you do with it ...makes the change.

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Marisa, this is an important statement.

The machine can only facilitate, not create the desired experience. It is one component of many that can be synthesized into a profound experience.

If there is no profound preparation there is little chance of profound experience.

Recruiting an emotional stimulus makes sense; you activate different physiological structures and potentiate the changes from the entrainment.

I'll mull this over and try out a few experiments; I will take your advice and park my waves between 8-11 Hz to avoid dropping off into theta/delta territory.

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I met monthly with a group of Buddhist meditators many years ago and upset some of the 'seniors' with my descriptions of meditation experience. They were upset due to having meditated for 30 years and experienced nothing more than deep relaxation states. Having a young kid describe unusual 'weird' experiences did not make any friends.

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Richard, I have had a few group meditation experiences and to date they have made me suspicious of the theology which usually accompanies them. Meditation puts people into a vulnerable psychological position; and I think groups use this to their advantage, and to the disadvantage of the individual.

Also, if your experiences don't match their expectations you can run into resistance. Pendulums are an excellent example; the movement of a small pendulum held between the fingers can be viewed as a motor event, a connection to the subconscious, communion with benevolent spirits or possession by satanic spirits. It depends on your preexisting belief system.

My current belief system limits me, but also allows me to function. Entrainment holds out promise as a tool for exploring my current belief system and alternative systems as well. Perhaps it can even help construct a meta belief system that patches them all together.

I will dust off my AudioStrobe CDs and put some spine into my sessions too. I will also persevere (in a relaxed way) to let go and let the analytical me have a rest.
:rolleyes:

Hi Ek,

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Originally Posted by ek49

Marisa, this is an important statement.

The machine can only facilitate, not create the desired experience. It is one component of many that can be synthesized into a profound experience.

If there is no profound preparation there is little chance of profound experience.

Recruiting an emotional stimulus makes sense; you activate different physiological structures and potentiate the changes from the entrainment.

I'll mull this over and try out a few experiments; I will take your advice and park my waves between 8-11 Hz to avoid dropping off into theta/delta territory.

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This is one of the main reasons why so much preparation work and detail goes into conducting a ritual (which always aims to induce an ASC). Mind you, the people doing the ritual may not be aware of why they are doing the things they do or the effect that the prep and the actual ritual have on their brain. :icon_wink:

M.

Restingg back in a warm bath, and burning insence or aromatherpy at the same time, gives me different stimuli during an AVS session , takes me to different places. Also doing AS sessions with a real Hi FI and no headphones helps to.

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Originally Posted by synaesthesia

Restingg back in a warm bath, and burning insence or aromatherpy at the same time, gives me different stimuli during an AVS session , takes me to different places. Also doing AS sessions with a real Hi FI and no headphones helps to.

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I also like real Hi-Fi to help vibrate the rib cage and body! But if using the headphones output I like to use in-ear type earphones. This is assuming you don't need the noise isolation of over-the-ears phones.

Also got some Shure in-ear noise isolating earphones which work great for movies and music on airplanes, so should try with my machines. Never thought. :)

But haven't taken a bath for many years!! :eek: But no worries, I do shower every day instead. Missing out on the relaxation experience you are suggesting. Mmm...

Hey people,

If you want inner experiences, and using more and more of your brain, the key is ofcourse stayig awake. Practise stepwise. Start with alpha programs, really get used to them, feeling you are totally aware during the whole thing. Then you moove to a deeper program and so on. If you allways fall asleep it's because you are not focused enough, meaning you need a mixture of all brainwaves. Without some alpha and beta waves during a low theta program you will probably fall asleep. Don't underestimate beta-high alpha!

The Three biggest keys if you want to evolve:

So 1: Train in steps, two-four weeks per program before moving to a deeper one. An amateur jogger can not do a marathon.

2, Focus: Keep your atention, even if you feel like just falling asleep. Either really focus on your breathing, or focus on your third eye chakra. Constantly keeping atention on the third eye chakra will start giving you inner visions of lights, objects, people and landscapes. So, Focus on breath, third eye or both at the same time. Focus is the whole thing, beleave me! Focus focus focus. After the program you can sleep.

3, wanting to practice: Many people fall asleep because they don't really feel like practising as often as they think, and force themselves (because they want results ofcourse!). Well, let's say you watch a show on TV you have no interest in. You will fall asleep. If your heart one day don't really say yes to practice, then trust that. Skip that day and do what you really feel like instead. Your heart must be free. The next day you might feel a longing again for doing your practise, and you will experience very good results!


If you are interested in focusing technique that evolves your conciousnes, take a look on my latest thread under sessions -> procyon sessions.

Kind regards
Marcus Knudsen

Helpful thread :)